Niiamah Ashong

Lee Collver-Richards, a self-described graduated kindergarten teacher who spent almost 30 years in public education and builds schools, joins Niiamah Ashong on the Outlier's Edge Podcast to talk about shaping the next generation through relationship and co-creation. She shares how one school was rebuilt around a fresh vision, and why the purpose of school is to uncover what's already inside each person. What emerged is a picture of values made real, and her call to have the courage to change.

Episode at a glance

• Guest: Lee Collver-Richards, Self-described graduated kindergarten teacher with almost 30 years in public education who builds schools
• Host: Niiamah Ashong, coach to outlier leaders
• Show: Outlier’s Edge Podcast, released July 12, 2022
• Format: conversation, 55 minutes
• Topics: Building schools as communities, Safe and brave spaces, Rebuilding around a vision, The purpose of school, Mistakes as first attempts in learning, The courage to change

What Lee brought to the conversation

Lee Collver-Richards, who calls herself a graduated kindergarten teacher, worked in public education for almost 30 years and has built a couple of schools, with more in progress. To her, building a school means meeting everyone who is already there and building it with the children and families as a community school. At one public magnet school, the team started fresh with a clear mission, a framework of science, technology, relationships, engineering, art and mathematics, a set of non-negotiables and a five-year commitment. She is also helping build schools for communities where parents never had access to education themselves, hosts a show of conversations with the incredible people she meets, and recently published an anthology with other authors on raising happy, resilient children.

What emerged

The conversation centered on values made real. Lee Collver-Richards describes schools built on integrity, respect, curiosity, adventure, wonder and gratitude, where a mistake is a first attempt in learning and every person's gifts are honored, like a custodian who had been an engineer and builder earlier in his life and became the school's best teacher of engineering. Niiamah Ashong named the shift from optimistic to realistic: what many people dismiss as not how the world works becomes the norm when leaders take agency and create places where it is lived. Lee's closing insight was to have the courage to change, knocking down the walls of one's own mind first and then building for others and with others.

Questions this episode answers

What makes a space safe enough for people to learn?

Lee Collver-Richards says the classroom is about creating relationships with everyone so all feel safe enough to take the risk to learn something new, and she describes safety as an energy. Niiamah Ashong adds that he creates spaces that are both safe and brave, asking what more risks people can take once they feel safe.

How do you rebuild an organization around a new vision?

At one public school Lee Collver-Richards helped build, everyone from the custodian up was let go and invited to reapply for the new vision. The team began with its mission statement, a framework to build from, non-negotiables such as every child from third grade on having their own computer, and a five-year commitment. Niiamah Ashong names mission, framework, non-negotiables and commitment as the pillars, and Lee adds self-awareness.

What is the real purpose of school?

Lee Collver-Richards says the purpose of school is to uncover, recover, discover and revise what a person already has inside them. Her school drew on research showing that people have multiple intelligences, so students could explore together while their different natural gifts complement each other.

How should a leader respond to mistakes?

At Lee Collver-Richards's school, FAIL stands for first attempts in learning. She says the error isn't rejected: people are allowed to forgive themselves for having chosen it and helped to see the other choices available, giving everyone the chance to earn the respect they deserve.

How can a leader with a strong vision bring it to life without convincing others?

Lee Collver-Richards says it isn't necessary to proselytize, because what she creates is simply how she is choosing in this moment. Niiamah Ashong invites leaders to stop spending energy convincing people and instead create the experience for themselves and with others, so anyone who wants to can come in and experience it.

In their words

It's about creating relationships with everyone so we all feel safe enough to take the risk to learn something new.

Lee Collver-Richards

That's really the purpose of school: it's to uncover and recover and discover and revise what you've already got inside of you.

Lee Collver-Richards

Knock down all the walls of your own mind first and then start building for others and with others.

Lee Collver-Richards

Key moments

03:03 – A kindergarten teacher who builds schools

05:35 – Spaces that are safe and brave

10:48 – Starting fresh: everyone reapplies

12:49 – The purpose of school

14:21 – A five-year commitment

16:52 – Mission, framework, non-negotiables, commitment

20:28 – The custodian who taught engineering

26:37 – Honoring first attempts in learning

37:24 – Schools for the whole community

53:50 – Have the courage to change

About Niiamah Ashong

Niiamah Ashong is a coach to outlier leaders, host of the Outlier’s Edge Podcast, and founder of the Trailblazer Collective. He coaches leaders who are creating something only they can make: a company, a body of work or a movement. Make a difference with your difference.

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Alejandra Castillo, project coordinator for a volunteer-led period education organization, joins Niiamah Ashong on the Outlier's Edge Podcast to talk about breaking the taboo around menstruation. She shares how her team uses workshops, research and conversations with lawmakers to make an invisible problem visible. What emerged is a model of a leader rooted in a mission much larger than herself, willing to knock on doors until the people who need to hear it do.

Episode at a glance

• Guest: Alejandra Castillo, Project coordinator for a volunteer-led period education organization
• Host: Niiamah Ashong, coach to outlier leaders
• Show: Outlier’s Edge Podcast, released July 5, 2022
• Format: conversation, 47 minutes
• Topics: Breaking the taboo around periods, Making an invisible problem visible, Research as a case for change, From activism to policy, Knocking on doors for a mission, Partnerships that let ideas grow

What Alejandra brought to the conversation

Alejandra Castillo coordinates projects for a period education organization that gives workshops to communities, universities and schools, and she describes it as the first chapter of its movement in her region. Her team are volunteers, and alongside service, education and activism they added research, because they needed information to prove that what they are doing matters. They are moving beyond the city to communities without internet access or information in their schools, planning a menstrual festival with academic and cultural spaces, and they have brought a proposed law to the national congress.

What emerged

Niiamah Ashong names what sets this work apart: a cause that has volunteers knocking on doors, running workshops and doing the research, rooted in a mission much larger than themselves. He invites every leader listening to calibrate what at the core of their own work can no longer continue to exist as it is, and how far they're willing to go so the people who need to hear it hear it. The conversation itself became a model of the future Alejandra Castillo is creating, one where the taboos that held people in the past don't have to grip them now.

Questions this episode answers

Why is menstruation called an invisible problem?

Alejandra Castillo explains that because people don't see menstrual blood, they assume it isn't a problem and that girls and women have already figured out how to manage it. She says girls and women are often searching for a safe place to open up, and when men aren't well informed, that search can meet a closed door.

How can men and boys support girls around menstruation?

Alejandra Castillo says the first step is for men and boys to learn, research and get curious about what menstruation is. She recalls an online workshop where a participant wrote in the private chat that they now knew how to help their sister and how embarrassing it had been for her to open up.

How can research make an overlooked social issue visible?

Alejandra Castillo's organization found there was little data, such as how many people can access menstrual products, so it added investigation to its service, education and activism work. Through that work they learned, for example, that some people in prisons use newspaper or bread in place of a tampon, findings that helped them show the issue goes far beyond a taboo.

How can partnerships help a new idea succeed?

Alejandra Castillo's team partnered with an international digital innovation organization on a hackathon about menstruation, even after the organizer doubted people would want to participate. One team's app is now competing internationally for investment, and Niiamah Ashong points out that by partnering instead of building the app themselves, they created a pathway for an idea to flourish.

How far should a leader go for a mission?

Niiamah Ashong asks leaders whether they are so into their cause that they'll knock on doors, go into workshops and do the investigations, and be willing to be the only one in an entire region doing it. He invites them to find what at the core of their work can no longer continue to exist as it is.

In their words

We needed information to keep going and to prove people that what we are doing matters.

Alejandra Castillo

Are you so into your cause that you'll knock on doors?

Niiamah Ashong

As little as it is, you can make a footprint in the world and you can help somebody out there.

Alejandra Castillo

Key moments

02:04 – Modeling an open conversation

05:07 – Helping men and boys understand

06:09 – Periods as an invisible problem

14:55 – Adding research to the mission

21:37 – From social media to lawmakers

25:13 – Calibrating commitment to your mission

29:17 – Where her commitment began

41:03 – A hackathon idea goes international

46:08 – Her message to every listener

About Niiamah Ashong

Niiamah Ashong is a coach to outlier leaders, host of the Outlier’s Edge Podcast, and founder of the Trailblazer Collective. He coaches leaders who are creating something only they can make: a company, a body of work or a movement. Make a difference with your difference.

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Catie Harris, a nurse practitioner who now helps nurses start their own businesses, joins Niiamah Ashong on the Outlier's Edge Podcast to talk about her path from the hospital to creating a business and a podcast for nurses. She shares how her first launch became a math problem to solve, and why permission and role models matter to the nurses she serves. What emerged is her view of business as a leadership role, and visibility as the decision to be seen.

Episode at a glance

• Guest: Catie Harris, Nurse practitioner who helps nurses start their own businesses
• Host: Niiamah Ashong, coach to outlier leaders
• Show: Outlier’s Edge Podcast, released June 28, 2022
• Format: conversation, 44 minutes
• Topics: From the hospital to business, Role models and permission, Turning results into a math problem, Consistency builds trust, Visibility as a leader, Leaders are made, not born

What Catie brought to the conversation

Catie Harris worked as a nurse practitioner for about 20 years before a role recruiting nurse practitioners for clinics introduced her to nurses who had started their own businesses, and she was inspired. She started a podcast to find nurses in business and learn how they came up with their ideas, committed to a weekly show, and had done around 120 episodes by the time of this conversation. Drawing on an MBA and businesses she had started before, she created a program to help nurses start businesses, launched it in January 2017, and grew it into multiple programs and offerings. She's most excited about her impact program and the team she has built for it, designed as a high-touch experience where the team is in the trenches with every nurse.

What emerged

The conversation turned from the business to Catie Harris as a leader. She named something she didn't appreciate at first: coming into a business means coming into a leadership role, and after years of feeling invisible in the hospital, she had to decide that her voice mattered. Niiamah Ashong named visibility as more than reach: it's the willingness to be seen, which he saw in the small choices she makes to show up fully. Her closing insight is that leaders are made, and once a person decides to be the leader, the path becomes very clear.

Questions this episode answers

How can nurses turn their expertise into a business?

Catie Harris focuses first on getting the ideas out of a nurse's head, so they can see how their expertise can become a business model that can be monetized in the right package. Her students have started IV hydration clinics, concierge nursing businesses and clinical research work. She says it's the nurses articulating what they want to do, and her role is to give them the space and the permission to do it.

How should a leader read the results of a first launch?

Catie Harris's first course launch in January 2017 brought four buyers, and her coaches showed her mathematically that it was a huge win. She now teaches nurses that once they can sell something to three people, they have a math problem to work out, and the math can sustain and grow the business.

Why does consistency matter when building trust?

Catie Harris says it's hard to sell courses if nobody knows who the seller is and what they do, so building the brand, giving things away for free and releasing her podcast every week became a priority. She sees showing up every week as a trust factor that tells people hers is a real professional business.

Why is starting a business also stepping into leadership?

Catie Harris says coming into a business means coming into a leadership role, something she didn't appreciate at first after years of feeling invisible in the hospital. She believes leadership isn't assumed for nurses in the medical world, so as more nurses come into business, the priorities are being visible, stepping into leadership roles and being their best selves in those roles.

What does visibility really mean for a leader?

Niiamah Ashong describes a level of visibility beyond reaching more people: the vulnerability of being seen. He points to the small choices Catie Harris makes, like setting up her space so people can really see her, as signs of trust and commitment, and notes that every leader finds their own way to be visible, the way she chose podcasting.

In their words

You can sell something to three people, then we have a math problem.

Catie Harris

Why be the best when you can be the only?

Niiamah Ashong

Leaders are not born, they're made, and you make the decision that you're going to be the leader.

Catie Harris

Key moments

00:31 – Role models for nurses in business

02:04 – Seeing nurses beyond the hospital

05:08 – Committing to a weekly podcast

12:15 – The first course launch

17:30 – Turning results into a math problem

21:34 – Permission and role models

30:19 – Visibility as being seen

33:55 – Building leadership in nurses

40:34 – A high-touch program and team

43:36 – Leaders are made, not born

About Niiamah Ashong

Niiamah Ashong is a coach to outlier leaders, host of the Outlier’s Edge Podcast, and founder of the Trailblazer Collective. He coaches leaders who are creating something only they can make: a company, a body of work or a movement. Make a difference with your difference.

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Jeannette Meier, an advocate for socially conscious leadership and co-creation, joins Niiamah Ashong on the Outlier's Edge Podcast to talk about allowing oneself to be and living from the heart. They explore the difference between holding space and creating space, a practice Niiamah calls active meditation, and why being oneself has to be experienced rather than only understood. What emerged is a simple path: explore, experience and practice being oneself.

Episode at a glance

• Guest: Jeannette Meier, Advocate for socially conscious leadership and co-creation, with a community where people explore, experience and practice being who they are
• Host: Niiamah Ashong, coach to outlier leaders
• Show: Outlier’s Edge Podcast, released June 7, 2022
• Format: conversation, 45 minutes
• Topics: Creating space versus holding space, Living from the heart, Active meditation, Explore, experience, practice, Socially conscious leadership, Co-creation versus collaboration

What Jeannette brought to the conversation

Jeannette Meier champions socially conscious leadership: the idea that every person can lead from the inside out by being themselves and by loving, valuing and respecting themselves and everyone else. Through her community, people explore, experience and practice being the leader they are, in conversation and in daily life. Niiamah Ashong describes her as someone who has created success in traditional ways and actively chooses to create beyond that, and who creates new distinctions for everyday experiences, like the difference between collaboration and co-creation. Her habit of listening, sharing and speaking from the heart, which Niiamah named active meditation, is something she practices in her conversations and reminds herself to return to whenever she can.

What emerged

The conversation became a practice in itself. Rather than only talk about presence, Niiamah Ashong and Jeannette Meier paused to breathe from the heart together, and the exchange shifted from understanding to experience. Jeannette's central point is that being oneself can't be grasped with the mind alone: it comes through exploring, experiencing and practicing, unlearning old patterns until it lives inside a person. Niiamah named a major insight about the importance of experience, after noting earlier that unpacking what comes naturally lets other people come along.

Questions this episode answers

What is the difference between holding space and creating space?

Niiamah Ashong sees safety as a platform: people can come in, feel safe and held, and leave almost exactly the same, or they can use that safety to expand, grow, play and challenge themselves and come out more transformed. Jeannette Meier adds that when people allow themselves to be, in freedom and safety, they grow and expand by learning with themselves and with whoever they're in relationship with.

What is active meditation?

It's the name Niiamah Ashong gave to Jeannette Meier's practice of already being in her heart, listening, so she doesn't need extra time to relax or close her eyes. She says it can be done at any moment, in any conversation, at work, at home or on a bus: going into the heart and listening, sharing and speaking from there. Niiamah tried it himself by becoming fully mindful of a simple breakfast before his first conversation of the day.

How do you get into the heart space?

Jeannette Meier shifts her point of view into the heart and starts feeling what she feels there. The heart opens, she becomes more aware of what's happening around her and of her own emotions, and feeling leads instead of thinking. She stresses there are infinite ways to connect to the heart, so each person has to explore their own.

How does a person learn to be fully themselves?

Jeannette Meier says it has to be experienced to be understood: by exploring, experiencing and practicing being who they are, people unlearn old patterns and expand. In her view, each person is their own leader and teacher in life. Niiamah Ashong connects this to the four stages of competence, from not knowing to doing something so naturally it no longer takes thought.

What is socially conscious leadership?

Jeannette Meier believes every human can be a socially conscious leader by living from the inside out, allowing themselves to be uniquely perfectly imperfect, and loving, respecting and valuing themselves and everyone else. She distinguishes co-creation from collaboration: collaboration can be an exchange, while co-creation is a dance of giving and receiving where 100 and 100 can create 300 and more.

In their words

Go into the heart and listen from there, share from there, speak from there.

Jeannette Meier

You are your own teacher in life, you are the one that is going to learn for yourself or unlearn for yourself.

Jeannette Meier

If we are in our freedom to be who we are and create what we love, we positively impact our surrounding and our world.

Jeannette Meier

Key moments

02:03 – Creating new distinctions

07:15 – Creative space versus holding space

09:19 – Balancing giving and receiving

11:23 – Breathing from the heart together

14:28 – Naming active meditation

21:41 – How to reach the heart space

28:23 – Explore, experience and practice

34:32 – Feel it instead of analyzing

38:39 – What socially conscious leadership means

39:40 – Co-creation versus collaboration

About Niiamah Ashong

Niiamah Ashong is a coach to outlier leaders, host of the Outlier’s Edge Podcast, and founder of the Trailblazer Collective. He coaches leaders who are creating something only they can make: a company, a body of work or a movement. Make a difference with your difference.

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Les Watson, a time management, productivity and small business coach, joins Niiamah Ashong on the Outlier's Edge Podcast to talk about finding his life's purpose and helping leaders reach their next level. He shares how a single why question, asked again and again, led him to name his purpose after 50 years. What emerged is a simple practice for leaders: look at yourself first, be supportable, and ask for the support you need.

Episode at a glance

• Guest: Les Watson, Time management, productivity and small business coach
• Host: Niiamah Ashong, coach to outlier leaders
• Show: Outlier’s Edge Podcast, released June 7, 2022
• Format: conversation, 44 minutes
• Topics: Finding your life's purpose, The why question, Self-reflection as a leader, Being supportable and asking for help, Ego and receiving support, Creating products that stand on their own

What Les brought to the conversation

Les Watson helps leaders fine-tune themselves so they can create change, by looking at what is working, what isn't, and what they can do differently. He works with everyone from multinationals to the corner store, with a focus on entrepreneurs, solopreneurs and small business owners who are ready for the next level. When his face-to-face work was shut down, he moved a program online, ran it five times in a year, and turned it into a coaching program built on about 90 videos. He also wrote the manuscript for his book over 12 months, a little bit every day, and is now creating new products on goal setting and goal attainment.

What emerged

The central idea is that purpose comes from a process, not a two-hour workshop. Les Watson found his when his wife kept asking him why he does what he does until he landed on a single phrase: he does it to bring life. Niiamah Ashong drew out that the real work is carving out time to treat the question seriously, with someone who brings deep curiosity. On support, Les Watson noticed that in a room everyone is willing to give support and almost no one is willing to ask, and he names the ego as what gets in the way.

Questions this episode answers

How can a leader find their life's purpose?

Les Watson says it is a process, and most people are never shown one. He found his by sitting down with his wife, who kept asking why he does what he does until he reached a single word or phrase at the core, and he encourages people not to let go until they find it.

Is it too late to find your purpose later in life?

Les Watson found his purpose at 50 and says the same structure of questions can be given to someone at 18 or at 50. He also notes people take it in at different speeds: in one couple he worked with, one partner found their purpose in an hour and the other took three weeks.

Why do leaders find it hard to ask for support?

Les Watson points to the ego, the puffed chest that says everything is fine when it isn't, and the worry that others will think less of you. He says leaders need to notice when the ego gets in the way and let it go.

What are the keys to getting support as a leader?

Les Watson names two: be supportable, by letting in the support people are already offering, and ask for it. He surrounds himself with groups, chambers of commerce and a monthly business group where he can ask the hard questions.

Why should leaders start with self-reflection?

Les Watson says the way to stand out is to look at yourself and ask what is working, what isn't, and what you can do differently, so you become an example others can follow. Niiamah Ashong adds that looking at yourself is one of the shortest paths to whatever outcome a leader wants.

In their words

I do it to bring life.

Les Watson

Number one is be supportable and number two is ask for it.

Les Watson

Everyone's willing to give support and no one's wanting to ask.

Les Watson

Key moments

03:07 – Fine-tuning leaders to create change

06:46 – Made a manager without training

09:22 – Starting his company again

11:25 – Finding his purpose at 50

12:27 – His purpose is to bring life

18:40 – Finding your own truth

22:49 – Taking a program online

25:24 – Writing a book in 12 months

29:03 – Surrounding himself with support

33:46 – When the ego gets in the way

About Niiamah Ashong

Niiamah Ashong is a coach to outlier leaders, host of the Outlier’s Edge Podcast, and founder of the Trailblazer Collective. He coaches leaders who are creating something only they can make: a company, a body of work or a movement. Make a difference with your difference.

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Fulfillment Obi, who helps people step out of mediocrity toward their destiny and purpose, joins Niiamah Ashong on the Outlier's Edge Podcast to talk about living a life of greatness. He shares the daily decisions that transformed him over the course of a year and how he brings others along by letting his own greatness show. What emerged is the idea of being a beacon rather than a brand, and a next level of greatness built on the capacity to handle pressure.

Episode at a glance

• Guest: Fulfillment Obi, Helps people step out of mediocrity toward their destiny and purpose
• Host: Niiamah Ashong, coach to outlier leaders
• Show: Outlier’s Edge Podcast, released May 31, 2022
• Format: conversation, 43 minutes
• Topics: A life of greatness, Being a beacon, not a brand, Leading with your strength, One step closer every day, No shortcuts to transformation, Building capacity for pressure

What Fulfillment brought to the conversation

Fulfillment Obi wants every human being to be able to live a life of greatness, and greatness runs through everything he teaches. He leads an organization and hosts a weekly podcast about self-improvement, where he teaches people how to live the best life they can, work with their purpose and produce tangible results in whatever they do. His turning point came when he gained clarity that he had something to offer the world: he wrote down what he wanted to do, asked himself every morning what changes he could make in his daily life, and read about six books a month while putting what he learned into practice. Over a year, he says, he transformed into another person and began to see opportunities he couldn't see before.

What emerged

Niiamah Ashong hears in Fulfillment Obi's approach the idea of being a beacon rather than a brand: knowing your greatness, growing that seed and letting it shine outward so the people in alignment are drawn in. Fulfillment Obi adds that no one needs everything settled before they shine, because leading with the strength you have gives you room to grow in other areas. The transformation he describes took real work over time rather than a shortcut, and his next level of greatness is about building the capacity to handle pressure, critics and more complex decisions, and taking his content up a level.

Questions this episode answers

How can a leader keep the bar at greatness while still bringing people in?

Fulfillment Obi says it takes consistency and intention over time. People look at the leader's life, so the leader must first show an element of greatness, something people don't see in anybody else, and keep building themselves so they can feed the people they lead.

Do you need to have everything figured out before you share your gifts?

Fulfillment Obi says no: if someone is a strong public speaker but still learning to lead, they should anchor on that strength while they build the rest. Waiting until everything is settled cuts away a lot of opportunities, while using the part of you that can shine gives you the opportunity to grow in other areas.

How do you transform yourself in a way that lasts?

Fulfillment Obi asked himself every morning what he could do to get closer to the life he wanted, read widely and made what he read practical in his daily life, and after a year he noticed a drastic shift. He warns against shortcuts and says a person has to be willing to do whatever it takes and walk their own unique path, even if they are slower than someone else.

What is the difference between being a beacon and being a brand?

Niiamah Ashong describes a brand as asking who you need to be for others to like you, while a beacon starts with knowing your own greatness, growing that seed and letting it radiate outward. People who are in alignment then get the chance to find it and be guided.

How can a leader build the capacity to handle pressure as they grow?

Niiamah Ashong talks about building the capacity of his nervous system, including a 17-minute exercise that helps him handle discomfort in his body. Fulfillment Obi returns to highlighted passages from a book that prepared his mind for pressure, talks with his family and mentors, exercises daily and makes time for activities that release the pressure.

In their words

I wanted every human being to be able to live a life of greatness.

Fulfillment Obi

Being a beacon versus being a brand.

Niiamah Ashong

You might be a little slower than somebody else but that doesn't mean that you won't eventually get there.

Fulfillment Obi

Key moments

02:07 – What Fulfillment Obi is creating

03:40 – A life of greatness for everyone

05:45 – Keeping the bar at greatness

08:51 – Glimpses of greatness

11:29 – Being a beacon, not a brand

12:30 – Leading with your strength

16:07 – The day clarity arrived

20:14 – One step closer every day

24:23 – No shortcuts, whatever it takes

29:33 – Building capacity for pressure

About Niiamah Ashong

Niiamah Ashong is a coach to outlier leaders, host of the Outlier’s Edge Podcast, and founder of the Trailblazer Collective. He coaches leaders who are creating something only they can make: a company, a body of work or a movement. Make a difference with your difference.

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Cordelia Gaffar, a coach, author and podcast host who calls herself the world's best joy monger, joins Niiamah Ashong on the Outlier's Edge Podcast to talk about operating from a baseline of joy. She shares how she transmutes rage into joy through research, writing and poetry, and why she tells clients to talk to the person rather than the journal. What emerged is the importance of receiving yourself: she is the only one who needs to validate her.

Episode at a glance

• Guest: Cordelia Gaffar, Coach, author and podcast host who calls herself the world's best joy monger
• Host: Niiamah Ashong, coach to outlier leaders
• Show: Outlier’s Edge Podcast, released May 24, 2022
• Format: conversation, 56 minutes
• Topics: A baseline of joy, Nurturing yourself first, Transmuting rage into joy, Talk to the person, not the journal, Receiving yourself, Commitment over understanding

What Cordelia brought to the conversation

Cordelia Gaffar calls herself the world's best joy monger, and she operates from what she describes as a baseline of joy. She says an extension of her mothering is the foundation of her work, because without nurturing who she is and who she's being, she can't nurture anyone else. She hosts two podcasts, one questioning whether her thinking is truly free and one exploring the labels people get placed in, and she won a podcast host of the year award. She has written eight books, is working on two more including a book of poetry, and coaches one-on-one while creating experiences that take people outside their comfort zone.

What emerged

The shift Cordelia Gaffar named came after she won a podcast host of the year award: weeks later, when a friend congratulated her over coffee and she said thank you, she finally received it. In that moment she saw that she had been hoping for validation from others, and that she is the only one who needs to validate her. Niiamah Ashong recognized his own experience in hers, of expressing himself fully and still not feeling received. She closed the thread with a distinction of her own: people don't have to understand each other, they just have to be committed and be their word.

Questions this episode answers

What does it mean to operate from a baseline of joy?

Cordelia Gaffar says she radiates from self-nurturing and self-compassion and transcends the experiences she calls character building so she can operate from a baseline of joy. When her nervous system senses despair or stress, she asks how to transmute it rather than neutralize it, and benefit from what is present.

How can a leader turn anger into something constructive?

Cordelia Gaffar created one of her podcasts out of rage, and she processes hard moments through research, inner inquiry, writing and poetry. Niiamah Ashong reflected those tools back to her, open questioning in public, deep research and writing, and said that for him the tool is conversation.

Should you journal about a conflict or talk to the person?

Cordelia Gaffar tells her coaching clients that if what they are writing is fully about somebody else, they need to talk to that person and tell them exactly what is on their mind. When the journaling is about something within themselves, she encourages them to give it time and space first.

Why can recognition feel empty until you receive it yourself?

Cordelia Gaffar physically received a podcast host of the year award, yet only received it weeks later when she thanked a friend for congratulating her. She realized she had a barrier to receiving, and that she is the only one who needs to really validate her.

Do people need to understand each other to work together?

Cordelia Gaffar says people don't have to understand each other; they just have to be committed and be their word. She sees that commitment as what is missing broadly in the world.

In their words

Without nurturing who I am and who I'm being, I can't nurture anyone else.

Cordelia Gaffar

If it's fully about somebody else, talk to the person, just tell them.

Cordelia Gaffar

I'm the only one that needs to really validate me.

Cordelia Gaffar

Key moments

01:33 – Speaking Cordelia into the room

04:07 – Mothering as the foundation of her work

04:38 – Operating from a baseline of joy

08:17 – Hosting two podcasts

11:25 – Research, writing and poetry

12:58 – Transmuting stress, not neutralizing it

15:35 – Talk to the person, not the journal

19:16 – Finally receiving her award

25:00 – The only one who validates her

48:31 – Commitment over understanding

About Niiamah Ashong

Niiamah Ashong is a coach to outlier leaders, host of the Outlier’s Edge Podcast, and founder of the Trailblazer Collective. He coaches leaders who are creating something only they can make: a company, a body of work or a movement. Make a difference with your difference.

Work with Niiamah: 1:1 with Niiamah | World of Difference

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